Livernois custom tune with upgraded turbos dyno results

[ONLYA6]

Also, onlya6's original post doesn't sound to me like he asked to stay at just 400... Where did you get that from?

I did agree on 400ish. Originally when I got the wrong sheet that showed 387 I said I would have been happier if it was 400-415 area and 430-440 tq.

As we see in the other dyno sheet I ended up with 395/443 which is damn near exactly where I figured I would be upon receiving the car back. Obviously if you have something in your mind that you are expecting anything less would be a slight dissapointment.

Possibly in the future I will get it tuned for more power to take full advantage of the turbos. I just bought a house so I'm not looking to replace a motor right now. Would it handle more power just fine? I don't know. There are two opinions on that right now. Of course I would have been thrilled to have 440/475 like it made on one pull during testing. I will settle with this for now until we see more long term experience with durability.

Like I said -- more power with less boost is always a good thing.

 

[ONLYA6]

IMO if owner and LMS agreed to tune car around the range that is stated then why was this thread even made by OP. Just saying .

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This sub-forum is called dyno results? No?

 

[southtxSHO]

IMO if owner and LMS agreed to tune car around the range that is stated then why was this thread even made by OP. Just saying .

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This sub-forum is called dyno results? No?

Well you were complaining about the dyno results . No ?

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[ONLYA6]

I've talked to Steven he was disappointed with his numbers, I'll help him any way I can to achieve his goals

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I'm dissapointed if the car can handle more power safely. If not then I'm alright as is. Especially since I see now I had the TQ I was expecting. 404 vs 443 is a nice jump. Thinking here over the last few days what next for the car, with the new house purchase, I decided I won't chance it right now.

Also, seeing what power it made on the 2nd sheet addresses a few points I was questioning -- most notably that the PPE downpipes were the reason for lower TQ numbers. They aren't at all.

In the end it's just a sheet with numbers. The track numbers will tell all.

 

[ONLYA6]

IMO if owner and LMS agreed to tune car around the range that is stated then why was this thread even made by OP. Just saying .

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This sub-forum is called dyno results? No?

Well you were complaining about the dyno results . No ?

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I was slightly dissapointed at the time of posting but mainly sharing my information from the tuning. That's the point of this forum and that's why I quoted your post asking why I even put this up.

It is resolved now since the correct sheet was posted and I'm basically right where I expected to be.

I do wonder if it could safely handle more power but deciding not chance that now.

 

[southtxSHO]

IMO if owner and LMS agreed to tune car around the range that is stated then why was this thread even made by OP. Just saying .

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This sub-forum is called dyno results? No?

Well you were complaining about the dyno results . No ?

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk

I was slightly dissapointed at the time of posting but mainly sharing my information from the tuning. That's the point of this forum and that's why I quoted your post asking why I even put this up.

It is resolved now since the correct sheet was posted and I'm basically right where I expected to be.

I do wonder if it could safely handle more power but deciding not chance that now.

Gotcha ! My bad then . Any plans on taking it to the track soon ?

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[ONLYA6]

If weather cooperates probably next week.

 

[4DRHTRD]

I'm guessing OP was remembering BPD's dyno with almost the same setup on a 2010 car.
ATP turbos, meth injection downpipes, hot pipes and air filter.
http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,2162.msg30576.html#msg30576
Even 443HP was a really conservative tune according to Mike, boost being at around 18 psi.
If anybody is going to find out if the motor is going to blow it will be Mike. I look forward to him running some 11's this spring on that setup, it's a package easily replicated and sold!

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

The questions about why are people building engines, and what are the limitations of the drivetrains have all been posted before. It is the end of the day and we will try to address more of the questions that you guys have tomorrow.

 

[Wilson]

Can't wait to see what kind of numbers you do at the track. Even with the "conservative" tune that thing is a beast!

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[JimiJak]

The questions about why are people building engines, and what are the limitations of the drivetrains have all been posted before. It is the end of the day and we will try to address more of the questions that you guys have tomorrow.

Thank you for your follow up.
I think the biggest questions from all of this are:

- If staying around 400hp was a cooperative decision between you and the customer, under your recommendations for longevity, why sell or recommend the upgraded turbos? Staying around 14psi sustained boost is something the stock turbos could easily handle, correct?

- Are you seeing a pattern of rod failures in 450+hp engines?
- What types of hp are they pushing?
- How many / frequently have you found this?
- Any other trends in the broken con rod engines?
    ie. where did they get the majority of their power?
          uber high boost, meth, turbo upgrades, E-85 mixing etc.


There is a lot of knowledge to be gained from your findings, and we would like to join you in establishing safer means of building powerful, modified daily drivers without breaking the bank.

 

[ONLYA6]

The questions about why are people building engines, and what are the limitations of the drivetrains have all been posted before. It is the end of the day and we will try to address more of the questions that you guys have tomorrow.

- If staying around 400hp was a cooperative decision between you and the customer, under your recommendations for longevity, why sell or recommend the upgraded turbos? Staying around 14psi sustained boost is something the stock turbos could easily handle

Stock turbos aren't going to make 400/443 at 14 psi. It takes around 18-20 I believe to see that with meth.


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[JimiJak]

I hooked up my Scan Gage last night and it looks like im seeing around 14 lbs in 1st and 2nd gear and it is steady at 16 lbs 3rd gear and on.
At this point the turbos seems like a waste but more power with less boost overall than running meth only is always good.

Oh, ok just going by the numbers provided.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

The questions about why are people building engines, and what are the limitations of the drivetrains have all been posted before. It is the end of the day and we will try to address more of the questions that you guys have tomorrow.

Thank you for your follow up.
I think the biggest questions from all of this are:

- If staying around 400hp was a cooperative decision between you and the customer, under your recommendations for longevity, why sell or recommend the upgraded turbos? Staying around 14psi sustained boost is something the stock turbos could easily handle, correct?

- Are you seeing a pattern of rod failures in 450+hp engines?
- What types of hp are they pushing?
- How many / frequently have you found this?
- Any other trends in the broken con rod engines?
    ie. where did they get the majority of their power?
          uber high boost, meth, turbo upgrades, E-85 mixing etc.


There is a lot of knowledge to be gained from your findings, and we would like to join you in establishing safer means of building powerful, modified daily drivers without breaking the bank.

The engines that we have seen fail have come to us as engines being shipped from around the country, not the whole car so we cannot see what exactly the owners of these engines have going on, many of these failures we have seen the owners have not disclosed their mods, nor power level, but based on our experience, and knowledge of these engines we know the range they would be in.

We have only seen a few failures from engines sent to us by other shops, so not that often. We have not yet had a failure with vehicles that we have done and tuned. The way that these vehicles are tuned also plays a huge part into the failures. The ones that we have seen fail are above the 450 Whp mark.

When we tune customer cars we go over all of the risks involved in tuning, and we make our customers aware of these. We then take our knowledge that we have acquired through testing on our own shop cars, and knowledge from OEM durability testing and apply that knowledge to our suggestions. Our goal in this industry is to be the best and offer our customers superior offerings and reliability for their vehicles. To us, reliability means years, and decades of enjoyment, not just a season or two.

We offer and sell components that exceed the power limitation because without them, there would be no expanding of the market. We want people to not reach a ceiling, instead, we offer our information to them to make an educated decision on what is the best route for them. Many of our customers that elected to push the envelope had it in their mindset to build an engine anyways, regardless of if, or when it broke. Being this customer specifically road races the car, we educated him on the reasoning behind scaling the power back to ensure durability, but the upgraded turbos will still have benefits beyond the HP and TQ numbers. And now, when he upgrades his engine after, he can really enjoy those turbos

 

[explorergotoluvit]

LMS Questoin

On your xsport have you had a engine failure? if not what are the HP/TQ number on it? what mods are on it as well?

 

[explorergotoluvit]

Im going to start a Question post for Lms so i don't have to keep posting on yours anymore

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

LMS Questoin

On your xsport have you had a engine failure? if not what are the HP/TQ number on it? what mods are on it as well?

No we have not had any engine failures, With just a tune and our Thunderstorm Cat-back exhaust we made 342 Hp and 397 Tq. This was with our CW tune and cat-back.

 

[DRII]

I just have to throw this out there;

I have owned and driven only Fords my whole life, with 1 exception. I have molded most of my Fords and driven ALL of them like I stole them. The only major issue I have ever had is with tranny's. Personally, on my SHO, I'd be more worried about the trans than the motor. I love my Ford's but they have trans issues.


Brad
2010 SHO with PP
170* T-Stat
NGK LTR7IX plugs, gap at 0.030
BOV VTA
MyCal LMS Stage 4+
Sent from my iPhone

Yep!  i think the most significant differences between the transverse and longitudinal 3.5EBs are the transmissions.

i believe the main reason Ford limited the power of the 3.5EBs in the SHO/MKS/Flex is to protect the tranny...

 

[Spartn27]

Yep!  i think the most significant differences between the transverse and longitudinal 3.5EBs are the transmissions.

i believes the main reason Ford limited the power of the 3.5EBs in the SHO/MKS/Flex is to protect the tranny...

The truck EcoBoost engine uses Borg Warner turbo's which are slightly larger, Garretts on the transverse. Longitudinal engine also has steel crank/rods and forged pistons while the transverse uses cast crank and rods and cast pistons.

 

[SHOdded]

A small glimpse into the world of the F150 EB:

http://www.full-race.com/articles/inside-the-ecoboost-f-150.html