Muffler shop said issue - does the forum agree

[m3dragon]

I went to my local muffler shop to have an exhaust put on. When they took it apart they said it did not look right. I added pictures below. They said there was to much " carbon build up". It s a engine so there will be some DUH. They seem to think the 3.5 was a partial zero emission motor. My understanding it is not.

They also said it looks off as in front of the secondary cats there was "metal particles. There looks to be some based on seeing some shinny specs. Again I say it is normal.

Car has 44k and was from Michigan. Motor and software are all stock. No engine lights and getting what is stated mileage for the car. VIN check shows no recalls.

As I am new to ECO boost world, making sure what I believe is ok and don't need to go to Ford. I have called my dealer and they of course are going to charge me unless their is a issue then they will cover it. Concern being they will say normal and be out 175 bucks for nothing.

Thoughts as to me looks normal

 

[bpd1151]

Normal.

Direct injection dumps more than average carbon soot out the tail.

Not qualified to diagnosis what you describe as "shiny metal pieces" observed, but the carbon is normal.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

 

[sholxgt]

I just changed the down pipes on my car and the originals looked the same as yours as far as the soot goes.  Funny thing is the exhaust on my catless Powerstroke diesel looked about the same.  "Eco" may not be the right name for these motors.  LOL

Not sure about the shiny parts, but I personally wouldn't take it in if it's running fine.

 

[FoMoCoSHO]

They said its a PZEV?

They said there shouldn't be soot in the pipes?

You need to find a new shop.

I have metal flakes as well, not sure whats up with that.

 

[FoMoCoSHO]

http://www.fleet.ford.com/programs/emission-guides/

ULEV II

 

[m3dragon]

I asked the tuner I am going with the same question. The reply is below.

I am going with my original diag of normal and the metallic is either some minor cat wear or what is below. there is so little there I am assuming from break in or other. As running fine will just press on and if fails replace.

"Carbon looks normal for these ecoboost motors, they run rich because of the turbos. But the material on the front of the cat is not normal. The only way that happens is when a turbo starts to make contact with the housing because of bearing wear which causes shaft play. My suggestion would be to check into upgrading them. If it continues to put material into the cat, it will eventually cause the cat to fail and then you could risk engine damage".

 

[ajpturbo]

Also with a stock tune air fuel ratios are in the high 10's which is super rich...normal for factory boosted cars to run that rich

 

[ZSHO]

It sounds like this shop has no clue what GDI Engines are all about!!!. Definitely agree the metal particles could be coming from the fragile components on the cat's.  Z

 

[SHOdded]

While not about GDI engines, the information here is universal to combustion engines, IMHO.
http://video.sae.org/11212/

"All internal combustion piston engines emit solid nanoparticles. Some are soot particles resulting from incomplete combustion of fuels, or lube oil. Some particles are metal compounds, most probably metal oxides. A major source of metal compound particles is engine abrasion. The lube oil transports these abraded particles into the combustion zone. There they are partially vaporized and ultrafine oxide particles formed through nucleation [1]. Other sources are the metallic additives to the lube oil, metallic additives in the fuel, and debris from the catalytic coatings in the exhaust-gas emission control devices. The formation process results in extremely fine particles, typically smaller than 50 nm. Thus they intrude through the alveolar membranes directly into the human organism. The consequent health risk necessitates a careful investigation of these emissions and effective curtailment.

Substantial information is available on diesel engine particulate emissions [2, 3, 4] but less for SI engines. Beside an example of metal oxide particles from a diesel engine, the present paper shows preliminary results of nanoparticles emissions of SI engines.

Four SI engines were investigated: two older and two newer engines, comprising two car engines and two motorbikes. The tests were done on standard transient driving cycles, and steady-state at constant 50 km/h and idling. Prior investigations observed, especially during idling, high concentrations of metal oxide particles [2]. All tests were done with particle samples collected from the CVS tunnel, during a long operating period, to have sufficient material for analyzing the composition. At the steady-state points, the particle size spectra were measured.

The results show that the older SI engines emit high concentrations of soot particles and metal oxide (= ash) particles. The size distribution is decisively bimodal for both soot and ash particles.

The newer engines' emission results are less uniform and the concentrations lower, as expected. Altogether, the concentrations of these metal oxide particles are so high, that more detailed investigations are recommended."

 

[ZSHO]

I purchased my SHO Brand new back on 8/13 with two miles on the OD and roughly 3,000 miles later installed my Corsa cat back and then roughly around 9,000 miles later installed my DP from www.ecopowerparts.com pic's below and thats when the MOD BUG started to to take over,lol and here are some great pic's which i was able to obtain for ya and hope it makes the OP feel somewhat better and BTW the pic's below are mostly on  TUNED miles.  Z                                                     

Sorry for the extra pics just couldny help myself.LOL.  Z 

 

[SHOdded]

Awesome stuff, Z.  Better too MANY pics than too FEW!

 

[m3dragon]

The carbon I am not so much worried about. The shop said it was almost zero emissions and that made me go I don't believe so but I should double check. Why we are here as I am still new to ECOs but seemed normal to me.

The bigger concern is the particles. But if they are the turbo or cats going at 44k, then is what is. Turbos go I will just get rebuilt ones that are better.