Power per mod discussion

4DRHTRD

New member
Thought this might be a good topic for new owners to review:
I'm going to rank these by my opinion of best mod by power per dollar spent.
1. Tuning - you can pick up 30-70HP here pretty easily depending on what fuel is available to you and if you want to run race gas or not. Figure around $500 with tuner. The lower octane you can run the lower HP you an pick up thus the range. If you really want to maximize your power with tuning doing a dyno tuning session with your tuner will pick up another 10 to 30HP (IMHO) but will cost you a few hundred dollars more. If you're looking for ever HP safely this is the best case scenario.

2. Meth injection
- you can pick up another 30-60 HP here depending on how aggressive you want to get with timing and your tuner. Cost between $200 and $1000 depending on how fancy you want to get with controllers, extra bottles for storage etc.

3. Turbo upgrade
- If you have a tune and meth injection (my suggestion) or an aux fueling solution (discussed later) you can upgrade your turbos. Worth another 30-? ??? (most HP now is 600WHP with aux fueling)HP. Currently the upgrades upgrade either your compressor wheel and/or add an aftermarket wastegate. There is also a full turbo upgrade coming this fall or winter so no one knows the true maximum output of the turbo upgrade scenario yet and how much power the block will take. Currently $1500 to $2000 for the two stock turbo upgrades, and $2200 for a true turbo center section upgrade.

4. Downpipes
- luckily multiple companies offer these now and they're getting cheaper, between $700ish and $1000 for around 20ish HP and quicker spooling of the turbos.
5. Exhaust - $100ish (remove 3rd cat, resonator and mufflers with straight pipe) to $1000+ for full stainless catback exhausts. Another 20ish HP here.
6. Intake - jury is out on this one, we've seen these drop ET/MPH from doing intakes but hopefully we'll be coming out with a new intake tube per turbo with a cold air or sealed stock style box soon. $200ish to $700

Optionals not normally used (my crazy mad scientist mods)
Nitrous - I've personally ran a 75 shot on my Flex and picked up .6 in the 1/4 mile. You can pick up a used kit and controller on Craigslist pretty cheaply and install. For all brand new gear it can get expensive. $250 (used parts) to $$$$$ for new.

Auxiliary fuel system -
I'm the only one who's built one so far, to replicate with what I know now around $2800. Gives the ability for unlimited fuel without the HPFP sagging under load. Needed in the long term for the true turbo upgrade or if you want to run E85. This includes injectors, dual in tank fuel pumps and a modified intake manifold or intake spacer (working on this one)

E85 or E85 mix -
Upgraded in tank fuel pump setup required for this one as the stock system can't handle ANY E85 mix without running out of fuel. E85 let's you increase the timing massively and run "hotter" boost while cooling the intake track off as well. An alternative to running alky/water injection but a true fuel, requires dual in tank fuel pumps to replace factory pump. E85 has allowed me to get to 600WHP on just a turbo upgrade and downpipes/cutout. You can run up to 500HP on E48 with just the in tank duel pump setup.

Exhaust Manifolds - Now that I've hit 600WHP, the small size of the factory exhaust manifolds is starting to get in the way, need to find a way to replace stockers, this might open up a way to also install a T3 turbo swap.

Water to Air Intercooler - 600WHP has caused me to start looking hard at the factory intercooler and replacing it. An aftermarket water to air will be the best scenario as there's just no good way to fit a big air to air in the front of the car. I'm guessing at the current 26PSI I'm at that I can pick up 30-50WHP here.

Dual-in-tank fuel pumps -
Auxiliary fuel system required for this one as the stock system can't handle ANY E85 mix without running out of fuel. E85 let's you increase the timing massively and run "hotter" boost while cooling the intake track off as well. An alternative to running alky/water injection but a true fuel.


That's all I've got for now, if we see more items we'll add them in the future.
 
shoman04 said:
Thanks 4dr good #s. But you forgot one, weight for every 100lb is a 0.1 sec at the track.

So loose 100lbs then! :P

The SHO is freaking heavy as hell... Hopefully the hopefully new one in 2015 will be a bit lighter.
 
Well weight loss should be free. I've been thinking about pulling all my interior except driver's seat and see what it weighs and how it will run. :)
 
Worth a shot, Although its probably only worth it when you're ready to really try and get some good runs in. Such a pain to pull everything.
 
darreli said:
crash712us said:
Uh-oh! Not the wheel weight argument again. Lol
Hopefully Darrell doesn't read. While you are technically correct, but with real world testing of our cars lighter weight wheels actually prove to be slower. At least in darrell case it has his 18lb tsw's have prove to be slower. It appears that the sho's heavy wheels help aid in putting the power to the pavement.

Thats funny s@#t! I was biting my tongue...LOL

I will be testing this... I have moved my 18" Nitto DR's over to some custom G8 bolt pattern Beyern Multi's... I am going to buy some bolt on wheel spacers that will allow me to run these 120 mm bolt pattern wheels on 114.3 mm bp Flex. These wheels weigh around 8 lbs more than TSW's that had the DR's on them earlier.

Perhaps lighter rear wheels are still a good idea due to the lack of available torque at rear.
 
If it's only 8lbs on two wheels the total drop should be about 1 tenth in the quarter. Assuming you can hook and the weight saving is not negated.
 
Great thread Mike, I  :salute: to your experience and insight on the Ecoboost platform, heck you're the guy that told me about this forum from that other forum(that just has SUV's ;), thanks for that! When I look at the platform as a whole and consider what  mods to undertake, IMO the intercooler upgrade should be a much higher priority on your  list.  I built a few of these same IC's from J Yard Mitsu Eclipse cores because they are compact, thick, and have great flow  potential when adding two or more together. I built this one for another project but I'm gonna use it on Quicksilver after modding the outlet to opposite side and increasing to 3". By the looks of the stock unit, just the IC upgrade alone is gonna be worth good quality power.  Do you know of anyone who did just the IC alone with B2B testing? I'll do the seat of the pants test but that's pretty un-empirical and way subjective... 
 
I just wanted to point out that an upgraded intercooler might not achieve the gains you are expecting with meth/water already one of the mods.  One of the true benefits of the meth/water injection is that it SIGNIFICANTLY cools intake charge.  In fact, a lot of the people I know run meth/water for the cooling impact and not really so much for the Octane boost.

There are some who even run without an intercooler on custom turbo builds because they have the meth injection.

A small shot of N2O achieves the same thing with the obvious HP increase.  Run say a 50 shot at the track and at the same time you can run a more aggressive tune due to the cooling effects as well.
 
QuickSilver said:
Great thread Mike, I  :salute: to your experience and insight on the Ecoboost platform, heck you're the guy that told me about this forum from that other forum(that just has SUV's ;) , thanks for that! When I look at the platform as a whole and consider what  mods to undertake, IMO the intercooler upgrade should be a much higher priority on your  list.  I built a few of these same IC's from J Yard Mitsu Eclipse cores because they are compact, thick, and have great flow  potential when adding two or more together. I built this one for another project but I'm gonna use it on Quicksilver after modding the outlet to opposite side and increasing to 3". By the looks of the stock unit, just the IC upgrade alone is gonna be worth good quality power.  Do you know of anyone who did just the IC alone with B2B testing? I'll do the seat of the pants test but that's pretty un-empirical and way subjective... 
You guys in the explorers have a "regular" intercooler, the other transverse motors do not and it would be a HUGE undertaking to upgrade the stocker.
 
I've been quiet on this thread while you gurus hash things out.  :popcorn: I do have a question.  I've seen folks chill the intake manifold with ice.  So what do folks think about the systems that use the air conditioner to cool manifold or intake air... to make it a real CAI especially in places like Phx?  :dunno:

4DR... your updates are much appreciated!
 
4DRHTRD said:
QuickSilver said:
Great thread Mike, I  :salute: to your experience and insight on the Ecoboost platform, heck you're the guy that told me about this forum from that other forum(that just has SUV's ;) , thanks for that! When I look at the platform as a whole and consider what  mods to undertake, IMO the intercooler upgrade should be a much higher priority on your  list.  I built a few of these same IC's from J Yard Mitsu Eclipse cores because they are compact, thick, and have great flow  potential when adding two or more together. I built this one for another project but I'm gonna use it on Quicksilver after modding the outlet to opposite side and increasing to 3". By the looks of the stock unit, just the IC upgrade alone is gonna be worth good quality power.  Do you know of anyone who did just the IC alone with B2B testing? I'll do the seat of the pants test but that's pretty un-empirical and way subjective... 
You guys in the explorers have a "regular" intercooler, the other transverse motors do not and it would be a HUGE undertaking to upgrade the stocker.

why is that? nothing but the size of the stocker will fit in the location, or becasue there is not one made as a direct replacement upgrade ? That would be nice to swap in a new intercooler for a meth like power increase.

thanks

Bigmac the killer chillers on the SVTPerformance seemed to be a decent upgrade is there something like that for our cars ? those a/c to intercooler kits are cooling off a heat exchanger / water / coolant intercooler system so it's not like ours though.
 
I was just wondering if the chiller makes much more power as it takes to run it.  We all shut off our a/c when racing just to get the power back that it uses.
 
68_GT said:
4DRHTRD said:
QuickSilver said:
Great thread Mike, I  :salute: to your experience and insight on the Ecoboost platform, heck you're the guy that told me about this forum from that other forum(that just has SUV's ;) , thanks for that! When I look at the platform as a whole and consider what  mods to undertake, IMO the intercooler upgrade should be a much higher priority on your  list.  I built a few of these same IC's from J Yard Mitsu Eclipse cores because they are compact, thick, and have great flow  potential when adding two or more together. I built this one for another project but I'm gonna use it on Quicksilver after modding the outlet to opposite side and increasing to 3". By the looks of the stock unit, just the IC upgrade alone is gonna be worth good quality power.  Do you know of anyone who did just the IC alone with B2B testing? I'll do the seat of the pants test but that's pretty un-empirical and way subjective... 
You guys in the explorers have a "regular" intercooler, the other transverse motors do not and it would be a HUGE undertaking to upgrade the stocker.

why is that? nothing but the size of the stocker will fit in the location, or becasue there is not one made as a direct replacement upgrade ? That would be nice to swap in a new intercooler for a meth like power increase.

Bigmac the killer chillers on the SVTPerformance seemed to be a decent upgrade is there something like that for our cars ? those a/c to intercooler kits are cooling off a heat exchanger / water / coolant intercooler system so it's not like ours though.

thanks

68... I could have sworn Killer Chiller made one for the SHO.. sure I saw it somewhere... maybe it was one of those other systems.  I just think about lost performance when it's likely 160o+ air going in to my "cold" air intake all summer here.

DJ... good point, nothing that moves is free as far as energy... where does it balance?  Maybe someone here has one and can answer the question. AC off, sure!  Would it help to cool them before the hole-shot or in a road race... not sure.
 
on the Mustang Cobras they run new a/c lines fromthe compresor to a box the intercooler water / coolant flows through to cool the liquid from the cold a/c lines that's it. A/c compressor should still work the same at shut off at wide open throttle anyway. You're just benefitting from something your car is already doing. I'd like to see the kit for the SHO if you come across it.

I couldn't find anything on a ecoboost vehicle for killer chiller but there's lots of info on those kits on a heat exchanger system here...http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/terminator-talk-229/969055-killer-chiller-gen-3-drag-kit-install-complete-pics.html
 
So they must be using the return ac coolant after the expansion valve in the cabin?  Wonder if the intermittent cycling makes much difference?
 
beats me I just don't see how this could do anyting for our intercooler systems since we are air to air. I think it would have to be completely reworked with parts that don't exist.
 
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