Since you are out of pocket, Mike, be sure to get the old parts back and post pics. If you had warranty, they generally refuse to give you the old parts back. Let's see what was in your XSport. Should be the dual toothed water pump and appropriate timing chain, but let's see.
2013 XSport - DTC P0016 - Camshaft Position Correlation, Bank 1
- Thread starter MiWiAu
- Start date
ebutler92 said:
I don’t want to jinx you, but the burning oil smell might be the PTU. That should also be covered under the ESP as well. I’d have them look at that when you bring it in for the code, so you don’t have to pay your deductible twice.
EDIT: The burning oil smell and the shudder/vibration you are experiencing during acceleration are both potential symptoms of a PTU on its way out.
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SHOdded said:
I called the SA and asked for the old parts.
What do you do with the old parts other than post sweet pictures to EBPF?
I assume for something like a PTU replacement, there’s a notable core charge.
I’ve always done my own service, so never saved anything, but this job was more than I had time for.
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SHOdded said:you are paying out of pocket, no such thing as a core charge. they may give you a refund if you let them keep the old parts, IDK, you would have to ask.
Well, sheeeeit! I’m totally saving up for a dragon, now! This would be awesome in my front yard!
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ebutler92 said:
I know you have ESP, but in case you (or future non-ESP victims) are curious, I've attached the estimate for the repair, which includes water pump replacement.
Note the (IMO) excessively high labor rate for the work: 16 hours @ $147.38/hr. I hadn't done the simple math on labor before authorizing the repair and was flabbergasted when I actually ran the calculation. I called the dealer this AM and asked them point-blank their shop labor rate, and was told $128.95. I then revealed who I was and my confusion around the $147.38/hr price on my service estimate. They put me on hold for a while then came back and said that they use grid pricing which essentially increase rates as job "complexity" goes up, hence the high labor charge. They did say, though, they would honor the $128.95/hr for the repair, and I'll take any help I can get at this point.
Does anybody happen to know if grid pricing is standard practice in the Ford dealer service world, or does each dealer set their pricing strategy independently? I think I've heard on this forum that the Lincoln dealers tend to offer a better overall experience. I found a stand alone Lincoln Black Label dealer not too far out of the way, and I'm thinking about taking future dealer service encounters to them.
ebutler92 said:
I mentioned this in my other thread that Z linked above, but in case someone stops on this one and goes no further...
You mentioned in the other thread that you also smell a burning oil smell, which prompted you to buy an OCC. I wonder if the oil smell + the stuttering/shaking might be indicative of pending PTU failure. When they leak, the oil often drips on the the exhaust causing the burning smell.
The stuttering may be related to the P0016/timing issue, or it could be that there happen to be two different failures occurring in parallel.
ebutler92 said:
Side note, I'm not sure which OCC kit you ordered, but I did a write-up a while back for my 2013 that may or may not be a useful install reference: https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php?topic=6716.15
SHOdded said:
One would think so, which peeves me even more, now that I have a rough idea of what they were doing.
I had never heard of it either, and there's not much out there on it. This is the best explanation I could find, and it's not very good: https://www.simple-car-answers.com/Grid-Pricing-Matrix.html
Basically, it appears that they start with a "standard rate", and for every additional hour over the first an additional ~1% is added to the hourly rate. The thought being (per the link above) that the more challenging jobs take more time and somehow justify a higher rate because they are more complex.
In my case, a 16 hour job is 15 hours over the standard 1 hour rate of $128.95. The job is so complex that challenging that the dealer deserves more pay to execute, so rate sees a approximately 15% surcharge. $128.95 + 15% surcharge = $148.29/hr (which is pretty close to the $147.38/hr in my original quote, probably off because it's not exactly 1% per extra hour). How sleazy is that?
I don't personally don't agree with this tactic, and I'll be sure I don't sign off on any future service under this pricing structure. Tell me time and tell me rate.