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- Thread starter Zalvern
- Start date
We know there are a number of factors that impact quarter mile results...DA, track prep, launch technique to name a few. Car & Driver tested a Cadillac CT6 with their 3.0 404 HP engine and reported a 13.5 quarter mile time. I would expect the MKZ to be in that area if conditions are similar.
Good to see the SHO is still the KING.Zalvern said:
I'm guessing You will need 150-200 additional HP to hit 11's...
I'm curious to see some data regarding your IAT2 temps as this is severely limiting me. My last outing had 100 degree ambients and 180+IAT2 and a DA of nearly 2700. At 150 the car starts pulling timing (by design) but still managed a safe 12.6 with just a trace of KR. Not bad for a tune and some corn. It will be interesting to see what happens on a cool night with the 7ish degrees of timing I was missing. Our intercooler is OK at stock levels but it's horrible when power goes north and environmental conditions go south.
Lucky for you there are FMIC's for the Fusion so maybe you will have better luck getting one than we've had.
Congrats on your PB.
I'm within driving distance of Edgewater, what were your impressions of that track?
Depending on where you are you should come up to Kil Kare some Thursday evening and take a peek at my tail lights.
OK, looks like DA was in the 2700 - 3000 range. That is far from ideal. The elevation at that track is around 700 so with better air, you you have been in the 13.7 range - about where a stock SHO is.
Another factor is the low miles. It will run harder after 5000 or more. You mentioned not being experienced at launching the car. What RPM were you launching at? That can make a big difference. Launching too gently will hurt your 60s and your overall time. With a stock AWD car like yours, wheelspin likely is not a factor so running your 40 PSI high tire pressure for lowest rolling resistance was probably a good thing.
Overall, considering all the factors, I don't think those are bad times. When the magazines test the 3.0 MKZ, they will be reporting mid 13s - I would bet on it.
Another factor is the low miles. It will run harder after 5000 or more. You mentioned not being experienced at launching the car. What RPM were you launching at? That can make a big difference. Launching too gently will hurt your 60s and your overall time. With a stock AWD car like yours, wheelspin likely is not a factor so running your 40 PSI high tire pressure for lowest rolling resistance was probably a good thing.
Overall, considering all the factors, I don't think those are bad times. When the magazines test the 3.0 MKZ, they will be reporting mid 13s - I would bet on it.
Neither the SHO or MKS has active grill shutters. I am surprised at your IAT 2 numbers. I have never seen mine nearly that high even under the worst conditions. When I run, I always take the engine cover off and remove the weatherstripping at the back of the hood. I also pop the hood release after slowing down from a run to let air flow through the engine compartment.
The CGI block is good for pressure but the one thing it won't handle any better is knock due to high IAT's. Downsizing (for FE) and the higher pressures needed to maintain desirable power are the reasons for the switch.
I know you said the car didn't pull timing but since you can't see the spark tables you really have no way of knowing. I'd suspect yours is compensating for high IAT's as well hence why a better intercooler may necessary. If you were at 170+ it doesn't sound like yours is faring better than the SHO's when it gets hot and heat soak sets in.
I know you said the car didn't pull timing but since you can't see the spark tables you really have no way of knowing. I'd suspect yours is compensating for high IAT's as well hence why a better intercooler may necessary. If you were at 170+ it doesn't sound like yours is faring better than the SHO's when it gets hot and heat soak sets in.
Can you add RPM to your graph?
Forscan works well and I think is giving you a pretty accurate picture of what is occurring real time. What it can't tell you is if which tables/adders/compensations are in play. I have the luxury of a tuner that can tell me all those things. I think you had power left on the table and when you run in improved conditions I'd bet it will be a 13.3-13.7 car. Mine ran 13.48 stock with a little E85. Fall can't get here soon enough.
On the SHO there are 3 sensors, IAT1, CAC, IAT2, and the air temp compensation is based off of IAT2. So temp reading at airbox, CAC outlet, and intake.
Looking at my track log my IAT2 fail starts at 160, drops to 151 (no help) and then starts to climb again from the 2-3 downshift to a max of 172 at the end of pull 1. I don't think the track design helps and traps hot dirty air, as soon as I pull around the wall IAT2 drops.
CHT starts low 200's and builds to 260 at the end. I'm curious if the difference is something hardware related or Quantum Blue coolant helping out or both. I have some sitting in the garage I should probably use.
Looks like you started at 110 so maybe your intercooler will be more effective than ours. That would be super helpful since you mentioned your desire to avoid meth. I share that hence my frustration with our IC and lack of aftermarket support.
If you want to look at other logs to compare what is going on, you could always download livelink from SCT. Some of us post up our logs we take for our tuners and at the track.
https://www.sctflash.com/support
Forscan works well and I think is giving you a pretty accurate picture of what is occurring real time. What it can't tell you is if which tables/adders/compensations are in play. I have the luxury of a tuner that can tell me all those things. I think you had power left on the table and when you run in improved conditions I'd bet it will be a 13.3-13.7 car. Mine ran 13.48 stock with a little E85. Fall can't get here soon enough.
On the SHO there are 3 sensors, IAT1, CAC, IAT2, and the air temp compensation is based off of IAT2. So temp reading at airbox, CAC outlet, and intake.
Looking at my track log my IAT2 fail starts at 160, drops to 151 (no help) and then starts to climb again from the 2-3 downshift to a max of 172 at the end of pull 1. I don't think the track design helps and traps hot dirty air, as soon as I pull around the wall IAT2 drops.
CHT starts low 200's and builds to 260 at the end. I'm curious if the difference is something hardware related or Quantum Blue coolant helping out or both. I have some sitting in the garage I should probably use.
Looks like you started at 110 so maybe your intercooler will be more effective than ours. That would be super helpful since you mentioned your desire to avoid meth. I share that hence my frustration with our IC and lack of aftermarket support.
If you want to look at other logs to compare what is going on, you could always download livelink from SCT. Some of us post up our logs we take for our tuners and at the track.
https://www.sctflash.com/support
MightBeASynth
New member
Thanks for getting some stock times, not bad at all but like with the Fusion sport I can't help but think it can't do a bit better even as it stands now but it could be that stock tune really getting in the way as you are seeing. Would be interesting to see a stock like tune with the AGS and torque limitations removed just to see what it could do from the factory without the leash.
Nice to know all I have done puts my little 2.0 within spitting distance of these monsters at least when they are stock ;-)
Nice to know all I have done puts my little 2.0 within spitting distance of these monsters at least when they are stock ;-)
Maybe some hood vents will help flow air thru the intercooler? And a water sprayer.Zalvern said:SHOdded said:can you post the *.fsl logfile anyway? We can look at it on the smartphone/tablet at least
Ha, silly me. That should work. I'll attach it via zip folder.
One thing I think I'll do is get a graph reading of me sprinting on the highway or so. Once I started the FORScan logging, I continued to drag without turning off the car. Any down periods is due to waiting in line.
I just want to find out the reason for massive heat soak upon acceleration attempt. If the Intercooler itself was poor, it wouldn't recover from such high heat so fast upon finishing the run. My Fusion was like that on stock intercooler because that thing was atrocious to heat soak, and it would never recover. This seems...to be temporary heat trapping issue during acceleration from 0.
Also...since you'll see the full log, I actually did have 4 attempts at the strip run. I just omitted one because I goofed and red lighted at the start (didn't trigger pre-stage light correctly). But the car recovers very quickly which is the impressive part.
AnotherGreenFusion said:
Heh definitely would never get cocky about buying a new stock tune car. So much more factors than just raw horsepower and torque, and even then, Momma ECU isn't going to allow any of that hoon driving easily.
Just goes to show how crazy conservative factory tunes are, and why tuning is such an effective impact on performance customization alone. I already expected this, despite the 400 HP/TQ rating. There's a huge catch behind it (and for any other non-performance minded car) since these cars have to be tuned for EPA and any kind of driver. It's not going to allow such power unless you're in a highway drive situation.
A Lincoln article mentioned "It's not in your face power". So the tune is clearly designed with only highway in mind for maximum power potential, or tracking style driving. It's still good on the street though, just not green light hot rod like many performance folks would like it to be when they hear "400 HP/TQ". I can only expect the same thing to apply to the Fusion Sport, which is why some folks seem disappointed in it but I think its being measured unrealistically and without realization just how many "nannies" are in place. If you want that raw responsibility of performance like old cars, a tune will be absolutely necessary.
The MKZ has the parts to perform strongly, but doesn't matter if the tune itself is made for getting groceries, going places, and cruising the highway. The electronic throttle body, torque management, all that computer stuff intercepts and restricts any form of performance racing or drag running with an iron shackle. Hence why before I even think about bolt on mods to upgrade, I have to unleash its real potential and learn from it first.
The best time to feel this MKZ's full pony power is to put it into Sport Gear while going 20-40 MPH and punch it hard, because oh man...it's pure performance ecstasy then.
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
Interesting that your paddle shifters work! Ford must have fixed them.
In my S, they are worthless. If I pull it when I want it to shift, it then shifts twice. Once on it's own for fear of over rev and then a second time once it gets around to acknowledging that I asked it to shift. The delay makes them unusable.
Thankfully S mode works fine as do the brakes for brake boosting.
You may be making your time at the track more difficult than needed. If your car is like an MKS/SHO, shifter in S, foot on the brake and bring revs to just over 2,000 and release the brake pedal and mash throttle when ready works quite well and is simple.
In my S, they are worthless. If I pull it when I want it to shift, it then shifts twice. Once on it's own for fear of over rev and then a second time once it gets around to acknowledging that I asked it to shift. The delay makes them unusable.
Thankfully S mode works fine as do the brakes for brake boosting.
You may be making your time at the track more difficult than needed. If your car is like an MKS/SHO, shifter in S, foot on the brake and bring revs to just over 2,000 and release the brake pedal and mash throttle when ready works quite well and is simple.
