Potential engine issue- need some help!

J

Jszudy

New member
hi all,
2010 SHO with 40k. Throwing Po302, po316, po53a, p1000, uo253. Appears to all be somewhat related to cylinder 2 misfire.  Plug 2 saturated in oil.
Just had new #2 coil, 6 new plugs, pcv, valve gaskets, seals, grommets. Did not work. Ford wants to send heads out to be looked at. I went against recommendation first and did the above, this reco was from a Ford mechanic family friend. Thought they were trying to go too far with that as step 1.
Compression IDS/manual
Cyl 2- 120psi
Cyl6- 132psi
All other cyl at 150
Cars runs rough, jerky when foot off brake, CEL on or blinking at times. Hear a "whoosh" sound, but not turbo spool, this is different under hard acceleration, small amounts of exhaust/smoke carbon

I'm afraid this more than carbon on valves.

What would you suggest my next step be and know any trusted mechanics in Long Beach , CA area.?
 
P053a is a PCV Valve code, so that is where I would start looking/checking.  That can cause a lot of issues, not unlike the EVAP purge valve.  It is possible that just replacing the valve will fix these symptoms, or you may need a replacement valve cover.

The lost compression on both banks is worrisome though.  Definitely advise checking borescoping the valves for coking. Can your mechanic friend do that?
 
Thanks all! I don't have a catch can and I did just replace the pcv valve and now it throws code po53a, I didn't have that code before. Not sure what is next. No oil separator changed

I will have to get valves scoped. I'm also going to repull plug 2 and 3 to see if there is oil saturation and compare, although I would think it would be clean even if there is an issue as the car has been driven 3 miles and plugs were replaced 2 days ago.
 
I was curious if you used the OEM Motorcraft heated PCV version for the my2010?  Z

Motorcraft EV-287 -  AA5Z6A666A. $19.52  ea
Build Date - Before 11/30/09

@Jszudy Due setup an Intro @ your earliest convenience,thanks.  Z
https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/board,14.0.html

YBtgmT3l.jpg


https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/ford,2010,taurus,3.5l+v6+turbocharged,1445050,exhaust+&+emission,pcv+(positive+crankcase+ventilation)+valve,5052

 
 
You changed plugs, otherwise, that would have been the first course of action
https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,6671.msg103422.html#msg103422

The PCV code you say popped up after you replaced it?

Do the codes return after being cleared? The Uxxx code being insignificant here.  This is REALLY important.

AND low compression?

Hopefully it is just coked valves, fingers crossed.  Could be a bad injector on top of that.

Based on the research on this forum, the final answer has been a new motor either due to a cracked piston or a cracked block.  I really hope it has not gone this far, but a detonation event is a killer for forced induction motors.  In that case, without warranty, a good used 2013+ block might be the way to go.
 
Yes, OEM pcv was replaced.

Yes, pcv code after it was replaced and low still compression

I'll keep you posted as this is a bit beyond my skill level now. Bringing into Ford.

Thanks all
 
Closing the loop on this.
I have scouring on cylinder 2 and 6 and looks to maybe be due to carbon buildup! 40k miles. No warranty. Ford will hear about this.
Need new motor.
What type of maintenance do you all do to reduce carbon?
See pictures of  damage.
 
:o  Running a high quality full synthetic oil will be important to keep it good from both sides, I would think.  The engine needs to be exercised regularly, and occasionally given the Italian tuneup.
 
Your issue sounds simple, yet major. Does the car smoke? Oil smell? Generally If you have lost compression AND spark plugs are "soaked" in oil, that indicates your rings and/or head gasket are bad. As you said, I would recheck those plugs and see if oil is present. Noting the difference in soaked and present. PCV valve can cause some oil on plugs but not like you describing.

I don't think a boroscope or anything is really going to narrow anything down further, just adds to the expense. Have someone follow you and see if car smokes under load or even just when you goose the engine!
 
Powertrain is a 5yr/60k warranty. While you are clearly out of the year range, your mileage is within (so although its a whichever comes first scenario, ford customer service MAY be able to help - I would contact them).

What is your service history like? Oil changes, etc. as needed/on time? If you can prove proper maintenance you may have a leg to stand on with Ford customer service. I have heard of them stepping in in cases like these (if it truly does need a new motor).
 
Forgive my newb question, but how can cylinder wall scoring be a carbon build up issue?  Unless the carbon build up is so bad that pieces are breaking off and going into the motor, I can't wrap my head around it.  At the point of pieces breaking off, the head would be fully coked and passages really blocked.

Did you buy this car new?  I'm thinking this is more likely a maintenance issue where oil changes were done at high intervals or with poor quality oil.  That or someone tried to do a motor cleaning procedure on it with too many miles for it to be safe and pieces of carbon broke off.

That being said, we've seen plenty of complete motor failures on well maintained vehicles also.  Those don't usually seem to make it to 40k though.

 
Carbon buildup on the cylinder walls or piston rings would hinder free movement, and if allowed to continue unabated, could cause, yes, stuttering, and ultimately scoring.  Sticky piston rings are and always will be a problem in internal combustion engines.

Although, you should be able to feel that roughness while driving to a small extent, like a feeling of something not quite right.
 
SHOdded said:
Carbon buildup on the cylinder walls or piston rings
Click to expand...

Carbon build up on cylinder walls or piston rings?  I can see that with a grandma driving a carbureted big block, but I can't imagine that happening on a high compression DI turbo motor.  Fuel is still being introduced into the combustion chamber.  Just not onto the backside of the valves.

Carbon build up on the backside of valves is a different story.  Seems to be happening at a rate that is drastic enough to have Ford implementing port injection on DI motors to solve the problem. My thought was more of a chunk of carbon getting dislodged from above the intake valve and being passed through the motor.

Who knows though?  Guess anything is possible.
 
Hotspots are still present in DI/GTDI engines.  LSPI is new terminology specifically introduced for this tech.  PCV issues continue to plague.  DI injectors get gummed up.  Issues with non-DI motors may have been reduced to some extent, but new problems have been introduced. 
 
Thanks all! I am talking with Ford, as of now I'm unsure what caused it and one dealer doesn't know. I'd be concerned if I can't nail the root cause and it happened again which is why a motor may be a good option.
I'm working with a service director at Ford who can go to bat on this.

Bottom line is no 40k miles car should have this, it's ridiculous.

I have maintenance records, I took care of it. I'm second owner since 15k.

Cars smokes at idle and hard accelv but not like a smoke show or anything. Oil/carbon type smell, not pure oil.

Carbon buildup noted in this pic
 
I had the same problem I had a bunch of codes but no blinking cel. Took it in they found cylinder 1&6 low I believe. Cracked piston and bent valve I believe. I’ll check my paper work I have at home. But without my warranty it was well over 10k for the job
 
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