Tune degradation????

[Dxlnt1]

My 2011 running LMS 4x tune seems to lose some of its bite over time. Cant really say how much time, maybe a couple months?

One time the car flat out wouldnt run at all. Had to retune just to get to smooth operation. This was also around the same time when my transmission went out. So not sure if related.

Using Torque for Android, my 0-60 time from a dig is around 9 seconds. Previously I was using iphone and Dash Command and getting 4-5 second times. I havent dont a boosted launch so cant say what that time is now.

1. Is this normal?
2. Does anyone else have to retune their cars to keep them pristine?
3. Does the Unleashed or L.E.T. tunes have same issues?
4. None of my "stock" cars require any regular maintenance on the ecm for car to run normally.
5. Is the Android app is slower to communicate?

The ever so popular booty dyno still feels ok, I guess. Car runs smooth. Had low battery and had to recharge is only variable. I think I retuned car after that since everything in car had reset. I went ahead just to be sure.

 

[SHOnUup]

Torque pro is way off for me sometimes. Giving me a 6 sec 0-60, but a 8.2 in the 1/8 on same pull...those #'s just don't work

The car learns your driving and starts "smoothing" it out. I reflash about every 4-6 weeks.



Rich

 

[cror1]

when you say you re flash, do you reload the tune, or do you disconnect the battery to reset the ecm?

 

[SHOnUup]

Reload the tune.

This is where the "learned knock" gauge would be cool. If it's actually working. Our resident guru is looking into this!



Rich

 

[Dxlnt1]

So rhetorically then, the cars "learns" driving habits to adapt shift patterns, firmness etc for transmission. Reloading tune constantly seems to defeat this. Is this any harder on transmission?

If you reloading on a regular basis, I guess I will have to as well. I assume the same holds true for meth and dp applications?

 

[ZSHO]

For me personally would check your battery for proper voltage with a multimeter,another note is the original battery on the cars have a short lifespan and they sometimes average onle three years,so basically a low battery can cause your issues,how does she start in the morning,any hesitation? i updated to the BXT-65-850 M.C battery,more cranking amps and overall better performance.

 

[Dxlnt1]

I did have issue with low battery. Drained enough to need a charge to restart. Dealer says battery fine, just needed charging. So whenever I do replace battery, I will be looking for a stronger one to use. Incidentally, this battery was replaced before I bought car in 2013 I think.

 

[FoMoCoSHO]

I have not had to reload a tune.

There was an issue in the early 4 cyl Duratec world of adaptive learning needing to be disabled or the car would "unlearn" the tune.

I don't think this is an issue with the Ecoboost.

 

[ajpturbo]

Questions like these make me wonder if people really understand what happens with a "tune" when you tune your car. If a tune is set up right, then there is nothing to relearn or revert to. The ECU doesn't store a previous version or a hard code within the ECU that it always will try to go back to.

When a tune is wrote and loaded to a device then flashed to the car the ECU has been completely reformatted and the ECU only knows what values have been inserted into all the various tables, and there are a lot. Even when the person that writes the tune leaves adaptive fuel control on, as long as it's set up correctly then it will adapt to what the tuner has defined in the tables and scalars.

The old tune is GONE when you flash your car, it is however stored in your flash device so you can revert to stock if needed. And for the guys with a 3 bar tune, if the car was in a constant state of trying to revert to stock then it wouldn't run well the closer it's gets to stock and eventually not at all. The values that are changed in a 3 bar tune won't allow the car to run if it was trying to get back to stock

 

[Dxlnt1]

Questions like these make me wonder if people really understand what happens with a "tune" when you tune your car. If a tune is set up right, then there is nothing to relearn or revert to. The ECU doesn't store a previous version or a hard code within the ECU that it always will try to go back to.

When a tune is wrote and loaded to a device then flashed to the car the ECU has been completely reformatted and the ECU only knows what values have been inserted into all the various tables, and there are a lot. Even when the person that writes the tune leaves adaptive fuel control on, as long as it's set up correctly then it will adapt to what the tuner has defined in the tables and scalars.

The old tune is GONE when you flash your car, it is however stored in your flash device so you can revert to stock if needed. And for the guys with a 3 bar tune, if the car was in a constant state of trying to revert to stock then it wouldn't run well the closer it's gets to stock and eventually not at all. The values that are changed in a 3 bar tune won't allow the car to run if it was trying to get back to stock

The question was not about understanding what happens when a tune is written, just the opposite. Generally speaking no car should need its ecm reflashed simply because time has passed or XXX miles on car since last ecm flash. If firmware update etc, thats different.

But if high number of people reflash on a regular basis, then it would seem there is a need to do so. Why is that? Is the question. And is it normal for these tunes on this platform?

 

[bamsho]

I only time I reflashed my tune is when I got the car back early Jan from the dealer cause they fixed timing cover leak that was just starting.  They had to take remove a lot to get the timing cover off.  They never disconnected the battery, drove car home, seemed little off, so reflashed and good to go.  But yes, they will learn driving habits, so I just jump on it couple times at week, to keep everything in line.

 

[SHOnUup]

I'd love to hear from one of our resident tuners that are very familiar with these systems on this.

As 95% of driving the SHO is in an "easy" manner for me. I "feel" like it definitely learns this and adjusts to it.

Then when tune is reflashed, the shifting feels much more harsh for a couple days.

Rich

 

[wasinger3000]

I've never noticed a loss of any kind and I've had my same tune running for almost 8 months.

I actually hate re-flashing because my Trans will destroy the tires on the 1-2 until it finally learns the correct pressure to make a hard shift and not a tire shredding shift.

 

[ZSHO]

If you go to your owners manuel and follow the battery and transmission relearn when battery is changed or disconnected,it will show that the engine must relearn its idle and fuel trim strategy for optimum performance,same goes for the transmission,it must relearn its adaptive strategy ,as a result of this the transmission will shift firmly which is normal,overtime the adaptive learning process will fully update the transmission ti its optimum shift feel,so essentially so many variables are to take into consideration pertaining to driving style which is stored on the ECM,when battery is removed or disconnected all of the data is erased and must later relearn it again.

 

[Dxlnt1]

If you go to your owners manuel and follow the battery and transmission relearn when battery is changed or disconnected,it will show that the engine must relearn its idle and fuel trim strategy for optimum performance,same goes for the transmission,it must relearn its adaptive strategy ,as a result of this the transmission will shift firmly which is normal,overtime the adaptive learning process will fully update the transmission ti its optimum shift feel,so essentially so many variables are to take into consideration pertaining to driving style which is stored on the ECM,when battery is removed or disconnected all of the data is erased and must later relearn it again.

So whenever battery is pulled or drained might as well ref lash tune anyway.

Also, so many are all over the place on this one. I did ref lash yesterday. Then using Torque, I got a better time, but near as good as it has been in the past. But, I don't trust Torque either. Seems to lag too much. Therefore, may not be very accurate. May gotta go to track again for real test

 

[SHOnUup]

I reflashed at the track after a few runs and netted worse runs.

My best was when I flashed before the hour drive there and trained it on the way.

Rich

 

[ZSHO]

If you go to your owners manuel and follow the battery and transmission relearn when battery is changed or disconnected,it will show that the engine must relearn its idle and fuel trim strategy for optimum performance,same goes for the transmission,it must relearn its adaptive strategy ,as a result of this the transmission will shift firmly which is normal,overtime the adaptive learning process will fully update the transmission ti its optimum shift feel,so essentially so many variables are to take into consideration pertaining to driving style which is stored on the ECM,when battery is removed or disconnected all of the data is erased and must later relearn it again.

So whenever battery is pulled or drained might as well ref lash tune anyway.

Also, so many are all over the place on this one. I did ref lash yesterday. Then using Torque, I got a better time, but near as good as it has been in the past. But, I don't trust Torque either. Seems to lag too much. Therefore, may not be very accurate. May gotta go to track again for real test

Yor are absolutly correct in both matters,time will tell especially at the track and keep us updated,also why does the 3-bar always have to be brought up by a certain member even if its not related to the topic,its really starting to P*** me off,stick to the topic,give us some factual and credible answers,if your so infatuated in a 3-bar,have an extra one which i'll give it to you for free.

 

[Airbornemaikai]

Yes I believe someone for some reason thinks were trying to say the vehicle relearns back to stock when tuned, which is not the case at all. No one ever said back to stock, its just relearning your driving patterns to adjust accordingly. I have indeed flashed many times changing between tunes such as 91, 93 and stock. Each time I do i disconnect the battery and let it sit for at least 30mins, and I can assure you the vehicle does indeed shift differently even if just flashing the same tune (after disconnecting the battery of course). There is no mistaking this.

 

[Txstrmhntr]

if the car is driven for a few weeks like a grandma aka in my case the wife taking it around town, and it hasnt had a good romping the shifts will get soft too soft imo. Either drive the car like you stole it for a few days before a track day or reflash the tune a day or two before track day. reflash is easy

 

[SHOdded]

Would be nice to have a "set & forget" point when you are happy with the way the car performs/behaves.  If you can have memory seats, why not a memory PCM?  Subject to the safeguards, of course.