Why not straight E85?

[SHOdded]

Welcome to the community, Warriormonx!  Do intro yourself here
https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/board,14.0.html

 

[StinkinLinkin13]

Yea... It seems to be two walls we hit at the injectors and Lpfp (lift pump)... Just don't really see spending 1700k on a hpfp to run E30 only.

 

[sm105k]

Yea... It seems to be two walls we hit at the injectors and Lpfp (lift pump)... Just don't really see spending 1700k on a hpfp to run E30 only.

I run E30 with a stock fuel system. My car is down for upgrades (tranny) but I don't forsee any issues using the E30 blend during the winter here in PHX, but only the data logs will tell. 

 

[StinkinLinkin13]

Yea... It seems to be two walls we hit at the injectors and Lpfp (lift pump)... Just don't really see spending 1700k on a hpfp to run E30 only.

I run E30 with a stock fuel system. My car is down for upgrades (tranny) but I don't forsee any issues using the E30 blend during the winter here in PHX, but only the data logs will tell.

Yes... That's the route I am leaning with AJP. I have to send him a shout out for being very helpful in emails and putting in effort on his end to help me out. I am a little worried that my oem HPFP may be a bit of a dud as it seems to hit the issues sooner than most (plus SATX cold is not Michigan cold). But no way for me to know without data logs having gone the livernois route.

 

[sm105k]

Brad will not steer you wrong.

 

[SHOdded]

Wait, Brad is tuning steering systems too?  That would be cool

 

[Macgyver]

Yes... That's the route I am leaning with AJP. I have to send him a shout out for being very helpful in emails and putting in effort on his end to help me out. I am a little worried that my oem HPFP may be a bit of a dud as it seems to hit the issues sooner than most (plus SATX cold is not Michigan cold). But no way for me to know without data logs having gone the livernois route.

Plenty of people run E30 on the Ecoboost without HPFP. That seems to be the sweet spot. And it Sure makes a difference from my Butt dyno thats for sure.

Also from my understanding of tuner people. Some are more efficient/better than others at fuel tables, boost application/tables etc. I have seen the same car have no fuel issues with one guy and fuel issues on the same car with another guy (making less power too).

 

[802SHO]

Pardon me if this is off topic but is anyone currently running an E30 blend with Meth or is anyone on here running straight E85 on meth?  I know Livernois mentioned they have at least one customer that is.  Curious if they are a member here.  Anyway, what could be gained by combining the two? 

 

[sm105k]

Pardon me if this is off topic but is anyone currently running an E30 blend with Meth or is anyone on here running straight E85 on meth?  I know Livernois mentioned they have at least one customer that is.  Curious if they are a member here.  Anyway, what could be gained by combining the two?

I know some of my turbo LS guys run E85 and Meth.  They are both alcohol based fuels that work well together.

 

[802SHO]

Pardon me if this is off topic but is anyone currently running an E30 blend with Meth or is anyone on here running straight E85 on meth?  I know Livernois mentioned they have at least one customer that is.  Curious if they are a member here.  Anyway, what could be gained by combining the two?

I know some of my turbo LS guys run E85 and Meth.  They are both alcohol based fuels that work well together.

Brad was on here earlier I was hoping he would chime in.  So yes I'm assuming if an E30 tune is better by the seat of the pants dyno 93 tune...and meth is better than 93 only...wouldnt an E30 Meth tune be better?  Old rule that more is better I'm hoping applies here.....

 

[sm105k]

Pardon me if this is off topic but is anyone currently running an E30 blend with Meth or is anyone on here running straight E85 on meth?  I know Livernois mentioned they have at least one customer that is.  Curious if they are a member here.  Anyway, what could be gained by combining the two?

I know some of my turbo LS guys run E85 and Meth.  They are both alcohol based fuels that work well together.

Brad was on here earlier I was hoping he would chime in.  So yes I'm assuming if an E30 tune is better by the seat of the pants dyno 93 tune...and meth is better than 93 only...wouldnt an E30 Meth tune be better?  Old rule that more is better I'm hoping applies here.....

I am willing to bet it is better.

 

[Warriormonx]

Pardon me if this is off topic but is anyone currently running an E30 blend with Meth or is anyone on here running straight E85 on meth?  I know Livernois mentioned they have at least one customer that is.  Curious if they are a member here.  Anyway, what could be gained by combining the two?

I know some of my turbo LS guys run E85 and Meth.  They are both alcohol based fuels that work well together.

Brad was on here earlier I was hoping he would chime in.  So yes I'm assuming if an E30 tune is better by the seat of the pants dyno 93 tune...and meth is better than 93 only...wouldnt an E30 Meth tune be better?  Old rule that more is better I'm hoping applies here.....

I am willing to bet it is better.

My tuner certainly recommended the e30 + meth or straight e85 rather than e85 + meth


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[802SHO]

Pardon me if this is off topic but is anyone currently running an E30 blend with Meth or is anyone on here running straight E85 on meth?  I know Livernois mentioned they have at least one customer that is.  Curious if they are a member here.  Anyway, what could be gained by combining the two?

I know some of my turbo LS guys run E85 and Meth.  They are both alcohol based fuels that work well together.

Brad was on here earlier I was hoping he would chime in.  So yes I'm assuming if an E30 tune is better by the seat of the pants dyno 93 tune...and meth is better than 93 only...wouldnt an E30 Meth tune be better?  Old rule that more is better I'm hoping applies here.....

I am willing to bet it is better.

My tuner certainly recommended the e30 + meth or straight e85 rather than e85 + meth


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Straight E85 instead of E85+Meth?  I wonder why?

 

[Warriormonx]

Pardon me if this is off topic but is anyone currently running an E30 blend with Meth or is anyone on here running straight E85 on meth?  I know Livernois mentioned they have at least one customer that is.  Curious if they are a member here.  Anyway, what could be gained by combining the two?

I know some of my turbo LS guys run E85 and Meth.  They are both alcohol based fuels that work well together.

Brad was on here earlier I was hoping he would chime in.  So yes I'm assuming if an E30 tune is better by the seat of the pants dyno 93 tune...and meth is better than 93 only...wouldnt an E30 Meth tune be better?  Old rule that more is better I'm hoping applies here.....

I am willing to bet it is better.

My tuner certainly recommended the e30 + meth or straight e85 rather than e85 + meth


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Straight E85 instead of E85+Meth?  I wonder why?

I didn’t push it - he can be a little prickly. I would imagine that the complexity of ECU controls to achieve a balance between meth and the aux rail / injectors might be a little risky?


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[802SHO]

Sounds very complex for a tuner thats for sure.  What would be any pros or cons running a blend like E30 with Meth?  StealBlueSHO where are you?

 

[Warriormonx]

Sounds very complex for a tuner thats for sure.  What would be any pros or cons running a blend like E30 with Meth?  StealBlueSHO where are you?

Personally, I love the idea of meth. Great for warmer climates to really reduce intake temps - that and you get a steam clean for your cylinders. Awesome. Add higher octane fuel with e30 and I reckon the RS would be really happy.


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[StealBlueSHO]

It’s easy really...

E85 effective octane rating and knock resistance makes as good as race gas. And it cools the cylinder charge quite a bit based on a studies. You can get A LOT of power out of E85. And it’s simple if you can run it. Fill and go. Heat isn’t a big deal from what I know.

E30 gets you close but not quite there. You can push more power than our motors can take with E30. But you need to monitor the mixes etc... and your still running into heat issues so a lot of tuners don’t like turning it upto 11 without a way to control the heat.

E30 + meth allows you to get the advantages of E85 plus the cooling of meth. This is more beneficial so you can run higher boost/timing allowed by the E30 and get the cooling of meth...the advantage is you are not leaning on the meth to keep knock away, you can use it more for cooling.



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[802SHO]

It’s easy really...

E85 effective octane rating and knock resistance makes as good as race gas. And it cools the cylinder charge quite a bit based on a studies. You can get A LOT of power out of E85. And it’s simple if you can run it. Fill and go. Heat isn’t a big deal from what I know.

E30 gets you close but not quite there. You can push more power than our motors can take with E30. But you need to monitor the mixes etc... and your still running into heat issues so a lot of tuners don’t like turning it upto 11 without a way to control the heat.

E30 + meth allows you to get the advantages of E85 plus the cooling of meth. This is more beneficial so you can run higher boost/timing allowed by the E30 and get the cooling of meth...the advantage is you are not leaning on the meth to keep knock away, you can use it more for cooling.



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So basically if I can get the mix down, this would be an excellent fuel set up.  I think I know what I'll be doing next.  Thank you kind Sir for your input. 

 

[802SHO]

A barrel of pure E85 isn't too expensive.  I could mix that with 93 and do my own testing for E30. 

 

[SHOdded]

Storage is the problem, just like with methanol.  As long as you are familiar with it, good to go.