2013 XSport Tuning
- Thread starter MiWiAu
- Start date
SHOdded said:If 93 doesnt help on an 87 tune, boy o boyYou should PM AJP to see what he thinks. You said you normally get Top Tier fuel right? Might also occasionally run a bottle of HEET through to absorb any malingering moisture in the gas tank/fuel lines.
Good suggestions, SHOdded, thanks.
I always go for top tier. Usually (85% of time time) I get it at Costco, since they are very high turnover. If not there, I use BP that has decent turnover.
I've been running 87 exclusively since I bought it in mid-August, and I was planning to start working on the 93 tune once I got these tunes sorted.
SHOdded said:
I have not checked for chafing wires yet - didn't realize that could be an issue. Does the chafing generally occur near the knock sensor and/or is there somewhere else specific in the harness to check?
With the OE tune, I recall some flat spots under WOT where power would level out, then pull again, but I'm not sure whether or not it coincided with a knock event. I haven't noticed this power delivery hiccup as much with the custom tunes, but I will mess some more this weekend and start paying closer attention for sure.
EDIT: Just found this thread regarding knock sensor chafing. I will check it out! http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,554.45.html
MiWiAu said:SHOdded said:If 93 doesnt help on an 87 tune, boy o boy
Good suggestions, SHOdded, thanks.
I always go for top tier. Usually (85% of time time) I get it at Costco, since they are very high turnover. If not there, I use BP that has decent turnover.
I've been running 87 exclusively since I bought it in mid-August, and I was planning to start working on the 93 tune once I got these tunes sorted.
Fuel turnover was always my barometer when choosing diesel for my cars/trucks, but it's not a measure for me with gasoline. I go for ones that have the best rated additive packages.
I'm a Costco fanatic, but I don't buy their fuel. I go for Chevron, BP, and Shell. Many on here swear by Shell giving them significantly different datalogs. If you have one nearby, it might be worth a tank to see if you get different results.
sholxgt said:
No Chevron stations around here. There are a few Shell stations, I could top off at to see if it resolves my problem; unfortunately, they're all pretty out-of-the-way from my normal routine to use regularly. BPs are everywhere around here.
I'm definitely curious about the possibility of chafed knock sensor wires; at the very least it sounds like it would behoove me to take some preventive measures. I'm going to check this first before I start changing my fuel, so I'm not changing too many variables at once.
Thanks guys! I'll keep you posted on what I find.
FoMoCoSHO said:
X2^^^^
16MagSport
New member
See if your KR drops with increased octane. I was fighting high KR in the stock tune. AJP gave me a tune with much less advance than stock so we could sort it out. Recently, I added octane and the KR didn't change. It also was very inconsistent and moved +4 degrees run to run with 96 octane and less advance than stock with only
12 psi of boost and a good 0.8 AFR. That pretty much said it was falsely detecting knock. It was just way too inconsistent. I doctored up the knock sensor wires and it got more consistent, but still seemed to be false. It would pull a bunch of timing but add it all back in before the pull was over. It would always add advance until I went WOT. Anyway, we added degrees back in the tune and the KR didn't change, so I still have some false stuff. AJP has been great helping me get this sorted out. The false KR sucks though because it is tying our hands a little with tuning. As you saw, Torrie used your logged KR to determine how much advance he could put on your tune. Ideally, you would have 0 KR, which means no knock detected but the tune is also aggressive enough that it doesn't keep adding advance with negative KR numbers. My problem is that I can't trust my KR, which sucks, so I just have to keep a "mild" tune. It still picked up almost 8 tenths in the 1/4 and 4mph! Maybe not so "mild." Let us know what your KR does after putting 93 in it. I did all of my logs on the same stretch of road for consistency. If you can, make a log, fill up, then do another log right away. That way the weather and temperature are the same between the two logs and the only change is the fuel. Post those two logs if you can get them. I am very curious to see them. Zip tie your knock sensor wires first as shown in posts in this forum.
12 psi of boost and a good 0.8 AFR. That pretty much said it was falsely detecting knock. It was just way too inconsistent. I doctored up the knock sensor wires and it got more consistent, but still seemed to be false. It would pull a bunch of timing but add it all back in before the pull was over. It would always add advance until I went WOT. Anyway, we added degrees back in the tune and the KR didn't change, so I still have some false stuff. AJP has been great helping me get this sorted out. The false KR sucks though because it is tying our hands a little with tuning. As you saw, Torrie used your logged KR to determine how much advance he could put on your tune. Ideally, you would have 0 KR, which means no knock detected but the tune is also aggressive enough that it doesn't keep adding advance with negative KR numbers. My problem is that I can't trust my KR, which sucks, so I just have to keep a "mild" tune. It still picked up almost 8 tenths in the 1/4 and 4mph! Maybe not so "mild." Let us know what your KR does after putting 93 in it. I did all of my logs on the same stretch of road for consistency. If you can, make a log, fill up, then do another log right away. That way the weather and temperature are the same between the two logs and the only change is the fuel. Post those two logs if you can get them. I am very curious to see them. Zip tie your knock sensor wires first as shown in posts in this forum.
16MagSport
New member
Another good way to log, which is how I did all my tuning with my Stang, is to just do a 3rd gear pull. Your tune needs to allow you to hold it in 3rd at low rpm though, which my AJP tune does. I do both a WOT run from 0 to 90+mph and a 3rd gear pull from 2500rpm to redline.MiWiAu said:
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16MagSport said:
Crap, I didn't see this until after I collected logs.
Secondly, I hope I didn't royally eff up my truck. Just after getting in from my last pull, literally two seconds after pulling into my driveway, the engine light started flashing, and the truck started idling really rough. GREAT. No DTC.
I shut off the car, then restarted it, and it cranked for 5 seconds before it started. Still idled rough. Let it run for about 20 seconds, then I got P0302 - Cylinder 2 misfire code, which I believe is the middle cylinder nearest the firewall. I'm going to pull the plug and see if it looks melted.
In the meantime, here are some data logs to look at:
87NoKnockFix is a new baseline run from this morning before I did anything.
87KnockFix is after I taped up the knock sensor wires on the driver's side. No chafing was evident.
91KnockFix is after I added 18.003 gallons of 91 no ethanol BP fuel. I thought the station had 93, but when I got there it was 91. I was 11 miles to E, so I didn't have enough gas to get anywhere else. I burned just shy of 1 gallon of the fresh fuel before taking my data log.
To me, I don't see a substantial difference between the three, and the big jumps in KR seem to coincide with shifting.
SHOdded said:
Yep, methinks so. I also threw code P00C6 (Fuel Rail Pressure Too Low - Engine Cranking Bank 1), and there is white fuel vapor coming out of the exhaust. Same exact symptoms as Tomc: http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php?topic=2650.0
Service department at my dealer closed 2 minutes before I called over there, and nobody was left to answer my call.
Looks like I'll be getting a tow on Monday morning. According to the 2013 warranty information, it looks like injectors are covered under 7yr/70,000 mile emission long term defects warranty. Hopefully I'm reading that right, and I can get this thing covered.I've already put my 2-bar MAP back in and reflashed the stock tune.
Couple of follow-up questions for you guys:
1) Can a custom tune cause this type of failure, or is this purely a coincidence?
2) What are the chances this injector being on its way out is causing my KR readings?
It's amazing to me that not 30 minutes after "treating" my truck to premium no ethanol fuel that an injector gets stuck. Good stuff.
At a glance on those logs I didn't see anything bad that happened. But I didn't see desired TIP or Boost that was all over the place. And the torque reductions on shifts have been eliminated. You didn't log torque source to confirm that but I don't see the dramatic spark retard at shifts which is the main way that tq reduction happens
If you log torque source you will see a value of 7 during an up or downshift.
And even at what appears to be stock boost levels your throttle is not open fully.
Do you know exactly what benefit you are getting from the tune? An explanation would be fair.
If you log torque source you will see a value of 7 during an up or downshift.
And even at what appears to be stock boost levels your throttle is not open fully.
Do you know exactly what benefit you are getting from the tune? An explanation would be fair.
AJP turbo said:
Thanks, AJP. I agree, an explanation would be fair. I sent Torrie a note Thursday evening, but haven't yet heard back. I'm trying to be patient, and I really appreciate you guys helping me try to fill in the blanks in the meantime. I figured I'd give him the rest of the weekend to respond, since I can't drive my car now anyways.
16MagSport
New member
I'll have to check the logs later. Use AJP. Nice safe tune that still performs much better than stock. Read my post about 2016 Explorer with high knock.
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