Hesitation in boost and high rpm

[StealBlueSHO]

I personally avoid doing any wot-pulls under 10 deg weather.  Z

That is absurd...waste of a car

I really can not see LMS boost levels of 190 kpa being a problem for fuel pressure for regular E10 gas at ANY temp..i enjoy going wot on a turbo car when its cold..they love it

The 10 degree ambiant temp really doesnt matter...once warmed up to operating temp id say your iat2 is around 50+ anyway so thats what the engine is really seeing

What would you say the cause is if it's not running out of fuel?

Ask LMS, without logs or any kind of data, it's very hard to speculate on that... not the answer you want to hear, but it's the truth.

I only mentioned fuel pressure because again, historically, when these cars hesitate under WOT, it's a fuel pressure issue.


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[ajpturbo]

I personally avoid doing any wot-pulls under 10 deg weather.  Z

That is absurd...waste of a car

I really can not see LMS boost levels of 190 kpa being a problem for fuel pressure for regular E10 gas at ANY temp..i enjoy going wot on a turbo car when its cold..they love it

The 10 degree ambiant temp really doesnt matter...once warmed up to operating temp id say your iat2 is around 50+ anyway so thats what the engine is really seeing

What would you say the cause is if it's not running out of fuel?

Really tough to say...wish you could capture a log....i want to say some type of torque reduction but thats a wild guess...tq reductions can happen by throttle, spark, fuel or any combo of the 3...they could possibly be audible and felt

 

[ZSHO]

The OP as stated on page 3 is working with LME for a viable solution in conjunction with having the fuel module recall performed and until then stay tuned and we need to move on.  Z

 

[FoMoCoSHO]

I personally avoid doing any wot-pulls under 10 deg weather.  Z

That is absurd...waste of a car

I really can not see LMS boost levels of 190 kpa being a problem for fuel pressure for regular E10 gas at ANY temp..i enjoy going wot on a turbo car when its cold..they love it

The 10 degree ambiant temp really doesnt matter...once warmed up to operating temp id say your iat2 is around 50+ anyway so thats what the engine is really seeing

What would you say the cause is if it's not running out of fuel?

Ask LMS, without logs or any kind of data, it's very hard to speculate on that... not the answer you want to hear, but it's the truth.

I only mentioned fuel pressure because again, historically, when these cars hesitate under WOT, it's a fuel pressure issue.


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I don't know, I've seen some absurdly low rail pressure with no hesitation and no issue hitting commanded AFR. Hell I've had logs where the car gave me nearly 27 degrees of spark with terrible rail pressure.

 

[ZSHO]

I'm hoping the fuel module recall is the culprit in this situation along with possibly a PCM update.
I also verified that Dan Millen over at LME will step in and help the OP out next week if your issues still persist. Z

 

[ZSHO]

Please lets keep our discussion's grounded and simply issuing a cautionary note in regards to preliminary data that the OP was able to obtain. Z

 

[ajpturbo]

Please lets keep our discussion's grounded and simply issuing a cautionary note in regards to preliminary data that the OP was able to obtain. Z

Nice move Z ...it doesnt have to be a witch hunt....but rather a chance for a member to seek help with an issue via a different avenue

 

[ajpturbo]

I looked at the logs you sent. Every time you go WOT your fuel pressure drops and it doesn't seem to recover...You even had a instance where your fuel pressure fell below 900 psi...It's consistent and does it every time. Your fuel pressure desired at WOT is about 2150 psi so you are well below...KR is ok and I don't see any reported misfires and AFR's are plenty rich so nothing looks unhealthy but you have a fuel pressure problem that appears to be mechanical

At the boost level your tune is at it should not do that and should maintain fuel pressure well. You are only targeting about 12.7 psi

There is something wrong with your fuel delivery...

 

[polskifacet]

Thanks for seeing that. Well WTF do I do now. Issue is only in winter and while tuned so dealer won't fix it. Damn I should probably baby the thing because blowing up again is actually likely.

 

[StealBlueSHO]

Thanks for seeing that. Well WTF do I do now. Issue is only in winter and while tuned so dealer won't fix it. Damn I should probably baby the thing because blowing up again is actually likely.

HPFP, LPFP, or FPDM...... I was having fuel pressure issues... when I replaced the LPFP I checked out the filter on the bottom and it was gummed up and black... after replacing it, there was a bump in fuel pressure...

You can rent a fuel pressure gauge and connect it to the schrader in the engine bay, back under the cowl, passenger side to verify that your pump is pushing the right amount of pressure... if it is, and you had the FPDM recall done, I would look at the HPFP. 

You may not be seeing the issue in the due to warm weather not taxing your fuel system quiet enough to have this issue... but the fuel pressure issue might still be there, just not as extreme.




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[ZSHO]

I know these cars a very stubborn and do not emit codes easily and would also have to agree with Stealthbluesho worthy assessment.
There is also an older TSB/SSM related to this issue in particular, best of luck on a hopeful viable solution.  Z

SSM 44315 - 2013 Model Year Explorer, Taurus, MKS, Flex, MKT, Fusion, MKZ, and Police Interceptor Utility and Sedan Vehicles may exhibit a fuel odor or hesitation.
Some 2013 Model Year Explorer, Taurus, MKS, Flex, MKT, Fusion, MKZ, and Police Interceptor Utility and Sedan Vehicles may exhibit a fuel odor, slow fill, or hesitation/stumble while driving and may or may not have one or more of the following codes present P0454, P0455, p0456, p0457, p0451, p0459 after Field Service Action 13S04 has been completed. This may be due to the fuel vapor line not beingproperly connected (fully seated) to the underside of the Fuel Delivery Module (FDM) which may lead to the carbon canister becoming saturated with liquid fuel.If fuel is found in the carbon canister and FSA13s04 has been completed on the vehicle, please inspect the vapor line connection to the FDM in addition to the normal diagnostics called out in the appropriate workshop manual.

 

[polskifacet]

Is the LPFP accessible from inside or does the tank have to be dropped?

 

[StealBlueSHO]

Is the LPFP accessible from inside or does the tank have to be dropped?

It's under the rear passenger seat. You can replace it from the inside. If you look at where the rear seat cushions connect to the carpet, at about the middle of each seat is an latch. Slide the latch over on both sides they will pop up. Then tilt the seat up towards the rear of the car, there is a hook on each side the holds the back of the seat in place, unhook it, seat should come right out, it's very light.

Side note: if you have heated rear seats there is a connector on each side that needs to be popped off...

The only tool you may not have that I would commend is a fuel lock ring removal tool... it makes it super easy to get the lock ring off the top of the pump.


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[polskifacet]

Cool I think the HPFP is the culprit so I think its worth the gamble to swap that out first. Any input would be appreciated!

 

[StealBlueSHO]

Cool I think the HPFP is the culprit so I think its worth the gamble to swap that out first. Any input would be appreciated!

There is a how to that I wrote in the how to section... check it out... I have a spare HPFP that I am selling if you are interested...although I would be surprised if it was the HPFP... let me know..


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[ZSHO]

Here's a post i made a while back with some Diagrams with step by step instructions on the sender, hope it helps any. Z
http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,6401.0.html

 

[FoMoCoSHO]

Cool I think the HPFP is the culprit so I think its worth the gamble to swap that out first. Any input would be appreciated!

Can you post or email me your log?

 

[FoMoCoSHO]

Do you normally fuel up at the same place?

 

[polskifacet]

only a couple select stations

 

[polskifacet]

I think since the LPFP seems to keep up with desired pressure, I will focus on the HPFP since that where it seems to be off. I can get one from the dealer for $190.